Need help deciding on my 1st DSLR

[kjh040606]

Hello,

I am somewhat new to DSP, but have been reading lots of forums trying to learn as much as I can before I take the plunge and get my very first DSLR!! I am so excited but also nervous, and want to get the best bang for the buck. I think I have narrowed it down to the following 3 camera's and would love any insight or suggestions that you may have. I have always loved photography and have decided to finally learn as much as I can about taking great photos so I thought that getting a DSLR would be a good start as well. I basically want a entry level camera to start out with since unfortunately I don't have a money tree growing in my yard. I will basically be using my camera to take pictures of my little boy who is almost 1 year old. I currently have a Sony DSC-P10 Cyber-shot and am sick of missing some great shots because of the delay. Here are the 3 camera's I have been looking at:
Nikon D40
Extraordinary Nikon image quality
Smallest Nikon 10.2-megapixel digital SLR ever!
High-performance 10.2-megapixel Nikon DX format CCD imaging sensor
Fast startup with instant shutter response
Shoot at up to 3 frames per second
Fast, accurate 3-Area Autofocus
2.5-inch, 230,000-dot color LCD monitor with 170-degree wide-angle viewing
3 colorful display options
Image Optimization options
Built-in Flash with i-TTL automatic flash control

Canon Rebel XT
High-performance digital SLR with 8.0 Megapixel CMOS Sensor and DIGIC II Image Processor.
Smallest and lightest EOS Digital SLR to date.(as of February 2005)
Fast 3 frames-per-second shooting with 14 frame burst and 0.2 second startup time.
High-speed, Wide-area 7-point AF with superimposed focusing points.
USB 2.0 Hi-Speed interface for quick downloads.

Canon Rebel XTi
High performance digital SLR with 10.1 Megapixel Canon CMOS sensor and DIGIC II Image processor.
Large 2.5-inch LCD monitor with new user interface and wide viewing angle. Fast 3 frames-per-second shooting with 27-frame burst and a 0.2 second startup time. High precision, wide area 9-point autofocus system.
Picture Style settings for a broad range of control over color, contrast and sharpening. Print/Share button featuring advanced camera direct capabilities for greater user control while direct printing.
EOS Integrated Cleaning System featuring a Self Cleaning Sensor Unit
Fully compatible with over 60 EF and EF-S Lenses and a wide range of EOS System accessories

I'm not really sure of what is different in the XT and the XTi except the self cleaning sensor unit.....how impornant is it to have this? I have held all 3 cameras in my hands at Ritz Camera just recently and really didn't have a preference one way or the other....they all felt pretty good to me. The prices I have found for these are as follows:
www.buydig.com
XT - $499.95/ body; $599.95 w/ 18-55 lens
XTi - $679.15/body; $764.15 w/18-55 lens
D40 - $549 w/18-55 lens
www.ritzcamera.com
XT - $699.99 w/18-55 & $50 gift card
XTi - $849.99 w/18-55
D40 - $599.99 w/18-55 & $50 gift card

Does anyone know of anymore good websites I should check out for better prices?

Also, what else will I need to get started? other lenses? Memory cards?

Thanks you in advance for any input!! I really appreciate it.

Jennifer :)

[Dani B]

I have been looking at these same cameras also and will be interested in hearing the replys you get. First camera like this for me too.

[Maikku]

I recently got the Nikon D40 the kit with 18-55 lens with 6.1 megapixels from Ritz camera. It cost me about 599.00 and game with the $50 giftcard I used it for an extra battery..... I believe the 10 megapixels is $200 more. I ordered the 55-200 VR lens just got it yesterday. It takes awesome pics.

[maryjos]

Okay, this is something I know a lot about so will be glad to give you some tips. First, you are going to end up with a great camera whether you go with Nikon or Canon. Both make really nice cameras and have huge selections of lens. The lenses you use and your own skill will make far more difference in your photos than what camera you use. I personally use Canon and really like their cameras and they do tend to often be slightly ahead of Nikon in innovation but there's really not a ton of difference these days.

First, don't get hung up on the number of pixels. Even 6 Mp is more than most people will ever need. What many people don't realize is the higher the pixels go, the lower the image quality often goes as well...you introduce noise at the expense of more pixels. Now, both Canon and Nikon do a very good job of reducing the noise so it's not a huge issue...but it's a good reason not to use the number of MP as a deciding point.

As for the self-cleaning...I would definitely recommend getting that. It does depend somewhat on how often you are switching lenses...I swap lenses a LOT and get dust all the time, and cleaning the sensor yourself is not for the faint of heart. From what I've heard, the Canon system doesn't always work if you have really serious dust....but it's certainly a big improvement over the older models which have nothing. Dust doesn't always show up on your photos though...it's mainly only apparent when you shoot with the lens stopped down....in other words, at a setting that attempts to keep everything in focus from front to back.

As for lenses, I think I made some posts here before on this issue. I'm not a big fan of kit lenses. 18-55 is kind of a narrow range and the lens is usually fairly low quality. I usually recommend getting just a camera body or at least getting a kit with a wider range of settings. If you can handle a bit more expense and invest a bit more off the bat, there are some really nice lenses in the $300 range that work really nice for most uses. Then budget another $300 or more for a decent long-range zoom. If you want to shoot stuff like zoo photos or children's sports you'll eventually want a good zoom.

I also highly recommend getting a bounce flash. Nothing beats indoor photos when you use a flash that you can tilt to bounce off the ceiling instead of flashing directly in the people's face. They will appreciate it, and the photos look so much better!! The Canon/Nikon flashes are usually pretty expensive but you can often find older models on ebay that will work just fine, or get a compatible model which often go pretty cheap as well.

Memory cards...a good way to get those is look on a site like devsdeals.com, or check by everyday for the latest deals on them. I'd suggest at least a 2 gig card, or ideally a 4 gig card.

Hope that helps!

[maryjos]

Thought you might find this link useful as well, it has links to a number of comparisons of these cameras:

http://www.vsxl.com/cameras/Canon_EOS_350D___Digital_Rebel_XT_vs_Nikon_D50.htm l

[maryjos]

More info for you here...I was curious at the description of the D40 you posted since I didn't recall it being 10 MP. And indeed, I think you have it mixed up with the newer D40X which is considerably more expensive. I would have a very hard time recommending the D40 personally. It's only 6 MP, but the biggest issue is that it is restricted in what lenses it will autofocus with. It may not be a huge issue depending on what lenses you might want to get, but it's definitely something to consider as you won't have that restriction with the Canon models. It's also interesting that they talk up it being small and light...these are not always good things with SLRs and often people choose Nikon over the Canon specifically because their models in the past have been a little larger giving you more to grip and thus more control over shake. It's more of an issue for men then women though (larger hands).

[spark]

As has been mentioned all are good cameras, all have had good reviews in various places, see if a camera store will let you hold them and see how each feels to you. I bought a DSLR a year or so ago, not one of these, but the deciding factor was that if felt good in my hands. can't explain it better than that. sorry. but if it 'feels good' to you then that is just as important as any review, you are the one who will have to use it.

[Tina]

I have the original Canon Rebel (after owning 2 Canon Rebel Film cameras). Its a wonderful camera. I've had it for 3 yrs with no issues (nor with either of my film Rebels). I am about to upgrade (for no good reason, really- lol) to the XTi. I'm very excited about it! :D

[beryl]

I have the Rebel XT and I love it! I take a lot of sport photos and even though my telephoto lens is not an especially good one I have some really great pictures. The only place in the US that I have purchased from is B&H Photo which has one of the highest ratings for photographic retailers. If you do decide on a Canon there is an online course that is geared specifically for the Canon camera and is relatively inexpensive.

B&H Photo - Rebel XT with 18 - 55 mm lens - $599.95
B&H Photo - Rebel XTi with 18 - 55 mm lens - $769.95

With the better quality 17 - 85 mm it costs $999.95 and $1179.95.

If you can afford the 17 - 85 mm lens that would be the way to go.

Whatever you buy, Canon or Nikon, you can't go wrong. Enjoy!

beryl

[scamptx]

Beryl--I just got the Rebel XTI and I am a rank beginner with an SLR. Can post the link to the course that you mentioned?

[kompressor]

If you want a DSLR that is easy to use, inexpensive, and has a good selection of lenses, then the Pentax K100D that Hattitudes uses is a great choice.
This was taken with the $100 kit lens. 6 MP

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s55/hattitudes/daisycloseuphatphotobucket.jpg


If you want a more advanced camera that is almost as easy to use, then my Pentax K10D would be a great choice.
This photo was taken with a 32 year old lens
10 MP

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/slipchuck/K10lauriesphotoshoot044.jpg

good luck with your choice,

randy

[kim]

All I can say is WOW!!!! Those photos are beautiful!!! :)

I have used the Rebel for about 3 years and just picked up the XTi... I love it. :) I was tempted to switch to Nikon because Lauren's camera was awesome and fun to play with. But! I would have had to invest in new lenses. I am thinking I will still be happy with it. :)

If you want a DSLR that is easy to use, inexpensive, and has a good selection of lenses, then the Pentax K100D that Hattitudes uses is a great choice.
This was taken with the $100 kit lens. 6 MP


If you want a more advanced camera that is almost as easy to use, then my Pentax K10D would be a great choice.
This photo was taken with a 32 year old lens
10 MP


good luck with your choice,

randy

[Whisper Pink]

Ok...I want to find out something...I also have been looking to purchase one of the cameras in the first post here...one of the things I need to know is taking photos in a dark setting and having to use a zoom. We take alot of concert pics, so that is one of the things I am looking for in a camera and one of the reasons I want to go to a DSLR. Can anyone tell me if one of these cameras would fit my needs better??? Of course, I would still need the camera to do the everyday pics and pics of my Darling Granddaughter!!!! Thanks for any input!!!

[maryjos]

Well, I can certainly give some advice in this area, as it is something I deal with a lot. First, what type of concerts are we talking about? Is flash an option? In general I find the Canons tend to have the best low-light/high ISO performance but the type of lens you use is going to have by far the biggest effect. Quite simply, most cheaper zooms are not made for low-light situations. You often need an f-stop of 2.0 or lower for dim light if you can't use flash and most zooms are way beyond this. The higher the focal length, the worse it gets. Even the expensive L lenses generally get down to only f/2.8. So usually your best option is to go with a fixed focal length lens. I personally use a 135mm f/2.0 lens which runs about $800. You can get the same lens in a f/2.8 for about $300 which is a decent low-cost option but will definitely be a bit more limiting.

If you want to go Nikon be sure to research their similar lenses and make sure they have ones that will fit your needs. Generally I think the Nikon lenses do tend to cost a bit more. Also be aware that with the D40, you have to use AF-S lenses to get autofocus, other lenses will be manual focus only. This is a restriction you won't have to worry about with the Canons.

[kompressor]

Ok...I want to find out something...I also have been looking to purchase one of the cameras in the first post here...one of the things I need to know is taking photos in a dark setting and having to use a zoom. We take alot of concert pics, so that is one of the things I am looking for in a camera and one of the reasons I want to go to a DSLR. Can anyone tell me if one of these cameras would fit my needs better??? Of course, I would still need the camera to do the everyday pics and pics of my Darling Granddaughter!!!! Thanks for any input!!!

In the case of the concerts and low light, it isn't so much the camera as the lens that is needed. Maryjo's info about which lens is good. A low F stop is needed.
of course a lot depends on how close you can get to the concerts.
The Pentax camera's that Hattitudes and myself have has Shake reduction built right in the camera so that it will work with every lens that fits the camera. This will help you get better lower light shots. With canon and Nikon that shake reduction is only built in the lens. The shake reduction in the lens makes an expensive lens very expensive.
The thing to remember.... shake reduction will not improve photography with moving subjects, only higher shutter speeds will.
Having a lower Fstop lens like a 2.0 allows you to have higher shutter speeds then a lens that has for example F4. higher shutter speeds freeze action better. If you had a lens with an F4 and took it to the concert, unless the stage is really bright what will happen is the shutter speed will be to low, causing people to be blurry when they move.

good luck with your purchase,

randy

[mecom]

I just purchased the Canon Rebel XT last month. I absolutely love it! More importantly, my husband loves it...this means I'll be in more pictures LOL. It's very easy to use. When getting into DSLR it's important to know it's an expensive hobby. We purchased the Canon XT kit (with lens) for $599; the starter bag which includes the Canon bag (it's a really sturdy nice one), extra battery (which run around $60 alone), and Haze filter (kit was around $90); a telephoto lens (about $200); battery grip (Amazon has the best pricing - went with the Canon, the others were flimsy) because my husband has large hands and it's easier to hang onto as well as more comfortable for portrait (rather than landscape) shots. It also holds two batteries, thus giving more life to your camera - HIGHLY recommend! There is a difference in the memory cards you get, too. Get at least the 1GB II and if you can afford it, the III. It makes a difference in turn around time with your pictures and download time.

I did a lot of research on the differences between the XT and XTi. Biggest ones being the dust sensor/self cleaner and 10 MP. If you are doing life-size or poster prints you may want the XTi, but otherwise the XT is great. With the money you save, you can buy more 'extras'.

Some pictures I've taken are at http://www.flickr.com/photos/mecom/. The cupcake pics were not with the XT.
My brother-in-law has some great shots, too, and is a bit more experienced: http://www.flickr.com/photos/zimmermans
Actually quite a few photographers on flickr use the Canon XT. Like: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jbird/

Good Luck!
Alison
Side Note: I also just bought the Canon PIXMA Pro9000 so I can print my 12x12 pages. Great Quality!

[kim]

Great shots, Alison!!! :)
That is pretty much the difference on the XT and XTi (I went with the XTi because I figured if I was jumping in (again) that I better jump with both feet)...and I am not sad I did. :)

Happy Shooting!! :)

[kim]

Mary Jo... Cute cute photos!!!! :)

Well, I can certainly give some advice in this area, as it is something I deal with a lot. First, what type of concerts are we talking about? Is flash an option? In general I find the Canons tend to have the best low-light/high ISO performance but the type of lens you use is going to have by far the biggest effect. Quite simply, most cheaper zooms are not made for low-light situations. You often need an f-stop of 2.0 or lower for dim light if you can't use flash and most zooms are way beyond this. The higher the focal length, the worse it gets. Even the expensive L lenses generally get down to only f/2.8. So usually your best option is to go with a fixed focal length lens. I personally use a 135mm f/2.0 lens which runs about $800. You can get the same lens in a f/2.8 for about $300 which is a decent low-cost option but will definitely be a bit more limiting.

If you want to go Nikon be sure to research their similar lenses and make sure they have ones that will fit your needs. Generally I think the Nikon lenses do tend to cost a bit more. Also be aware that with the D40, you have to use AF-S lenses to get autofocus, other lenses will be manual focus only. This is a restriction you won't have to worry about with the Canons.

[maryjos]

Mary Jo... Cute cute photos!!!! :)

Thanks Kim....but not sure what photos you mean??

A couple other suggestions in response to some other posts. I personally look for batteries on Ebay...you can get Canon-compatible batteries far cheaper and they work just the same. You definitely should always have at least one backup battery, if not two, so better to pay $15 each than $60 for them! I hardly ever buy batteries from the original manufacturer anymore whether it's a camera, cell phone, PDA, whatever, they just overcharge so much for them.

For memory cards, sites like devsdeals.com that scour the web for good deals are a great way to go. Again, don't buy these cards with your camera, you'll pay so much more than if you shop separately for them. I personally prefer compact flash as you can generally get it cheaper for more space than with SD, but the gap has definitely narrowed a lot on those and for casual use you may prefer to use SD if your camera supports it. SD is supported by a wider variety of devices these days, so if for instance you have a PDA, compact camera, printer, laptop, etc. that all can take SD you might want to go with SD so you can use the cards in different devices. My PDA can take either SD or CF and I can read both easily on my laptop or on my portable printer, so either works well for me.

[Emma]

you can't really go wrong with any of those choices you listed, so your biggest concern at this point is getting a good deal and liking the user-friendliness of one vs the other. The camera body is far less important than the lenses, so be sure to research them well and buy the best you can. Lens shopping can be really confusing as a beginner, so learning some terminology goes a long way! Read any articles you can google, talk to the camera store pros but do not buy yet. I borrowed a really, really nice lens, far more than I can afford, and the difference between it and my lens was striking! I didn't realize how important it was until then, and I carefully returned it to the owner once I saw how much it cost! In fact, I can't believe he let me out of his house with it!

[kim]

Hi Maryjos... the dogs in action photos ... and I think you had some of yellowstone and other places on your website? I just enjoyed looking at those dogies jumping and running! :)

Thanks Kim....but not sure what photos you mean??

[maryjos]

Ah, okay! I wasn't sure if you meant the photos in this thread which I didn't take so didn't want to take credit for someone else's work! Glad you enjoyed my photos...yeah, I love doing dog action shots, that's definitely where most of my experience and skill is. Yellowstone was an awesome place to visit, I just wish I had even bigger lens to work with there! My poor BF at the time would have killed me though if I made him carry even more photographic equipment than he already was. LOL

[loonyhiker]

Maryjos:
I've been thinking about getting a new camera and noticed the link to your web site so I just had to go look. I just love the photos in your gallery. Yellowstone and Grand Teton brought back some good memories and we hope to go back next year (hopefully with my new camera!)

[maryjos]

Thanks! I hope to go back again sometime and really take my time visiting some of the lesser known areas. Just going a different time of year makes it a very different experience!